Believe it or not i am still chasing the running issue due to a complete lack of time over recent months.
A recap on the issue as the symptoms seem to have changed: Cyliders 1 & 4 are running hotter than 2 & 3. The engine isnt running smooth and pops and misses when riding although doesn't when rev'd in neutral.
After a few mins of running measuring the exhaust temperatures near the collets with a temperature gun (thanks for the pointer Taffus)
1 & 4 run at 140 deg
2 & 3 run at 30 deg
I have ...
I think next is to check out the IC Igniter but am open to any other suggestions.
**** Update 16th July 2015 *****
The compression tester arrived today so I ventured out into the garage.
Results @ 20 C
Cylinder 1 = 8 bar (112 PSI)
Cylinder 2 = 7 bar (100 PSI)
Cylinder 3 = 8 bar (112 PSI)
Cylinder 4 = 7 bar (100 PSI)
These are apparently ok.
**** Update 18th July 2015 *****
**** Update 19th Jul 2015 ****
Still wouldn't start even with a full charge on the battery. One of the suggestions through the Z1 Owners forum was to synchronise the throttle bodies. I don't have the gauges to do this properly but another post suggested a quick and dirty way was to prop open one butterfly with a small drill bit and then adjust the others using the same sized drill bit as the guide - this way they all open the same. So i removed the throttle body (getting to be a dab hand at that!!) and adjusted as required - which wasn't too much but never the same they did need changing.
A recap on the issue as the symptoms seem to have changed: Cyliders 1 & 4 are running hotter than 2 & 3. The engine isnt running smooth and pops and misses when riding although doesn't when rev'd in neutral.
After a few mins of running measuring the exhaust temperatures near the collets with a temperature gun (thanks for the pointer Taffus)
1 & 4 run at 140 deg
2 & 3 run at 30 deg
I have ...
- had the injectors cleaned
- can hear each injector 'clicking'
- checked the coils ok as well as swapped them around - the issue stays with the cylinders
- checked out the coil HT leads and measured the impedance across the coil windings
- checked out the pickup coils a room temp as well as while being heated
- replaced the spark plugs
- verified that I have what seems to be a good spark on all plugs
- all plugs are wet after running the bike ...i.e. i know fuel is getting to all plugs
- visual check on throttle body seals
I think next is to check out the IC Igniter but am open to any other suggestions.
**** Update 16th July 2015 *****
The compression tester arrived today so I ventured out into the garage.
Results @ 20 C
Cylinder 1 = 8 bar (112 PSI)
Cylinder 2 = 7 bar (100 PSI)
Cylinder 3 = 8 bar (112 PSI)
Cylinder 4 = 7 bar (100 PSI)
These are apparently ok.
**** Update 18th July 2015 *****
- Changed out injectors 2 & 3
- Cleaned throttle body butterflies
- Changed out spark plugs with a spare set
**** Update 19th Jul 2015 ****
Still wouldn't start even with a full charge on the battery. One of the suggestions through the Z1 Owners forum was to synchronise the throttle bodies. I don't have the gauges to do this properly but another post suggested a quick and dirty way was to prop open one butterfly with a small drill bit and then adjust the others using the same sized drill bit as the guide - this way they all open the same. So i removed the throttle body (getting to be a dab hand at that!!) and adjusted as required - which wasn't too much but never the same they did need changing.
I also went through the motions of verifying that the ignition pickup coils were aligned when the cylinders were 'top dead centre' TDC.
To do this I removed the spark plugs and then used a small bit of dowel down into the cylinder to gauge when the cylinders were at the top of their rotation.
Obviously 1 & 4 are the same as are 2 & 3. When the cylinder was TDC i checked the alignment of the pickup to the center rotator. The plate did need a small amount of adjustment to correct the alignment.
To do this I removed the spark plugs and then used a small bit of dowel down into the cylinder to gauge when the cylinders were at the top of their rotation.
Obviously 1 & 4 are the same as are 2 & 3. When the cylinder was TDC i checked the alignment of the pickup to the center rotator. The plate did need a small amount of adjustment to correct the alignment.
Finally I put everything back together ..and she still wouldn't run. I went back to basics and verified I had a spark on each plug then changed the plugs back to the original BR8ES plugs I was using right at the start...and she bloody started. Only running on two cylinders mind you but started all the same. So unless I'm going mad I have a bad set of plugs. The other set I have are B8ES so I don't really want to start mixing as they'll be mismatched and I'm not sure what results to expect let alone any impact. I suspect mixing plug types wouldn't be a good idea as there would be an unbalance in sparks delivered to each cylinder.
The plug with the 'R' has a 5k ohm resistor which acts as a noise suppressor for sensitive ECU's and that interference we used to hear when listening to AM radio when a bike went passed. Thats great but the downside is that it lowers the voltage and therefore you get a weaker spark at the plug. I therefore changed my plugs out to the non-resister type B8ES.
With the BR8ES plugs fitted I saw cylinders 1 & 3 running warm and 2 & 4 cold. I draw therefore that the plugs in 1 & 3 are good. So I swapped plugs 1 & 4 and low and behold 4 started running hot and 1 cold ..which sort of proves the point. I won't have any time this week now so have ordered a set of B8ES plugs ready for next weekend.
**** UPDATE 26th July 2015 ****
She now starts and purrs . I just need it to dry up a bit outside so I can take her for a spin to confirm she runs ok under load.
I managed to clear out a few issues along the way but having just gone right back to basics I appear to have found two faulty spark plugs - WTF! Replacing them with a brand new set has done the final trick. Yes, i did swap plugs around but i think the other issues were masking visibility of a plug issue.
Injectors tested and cleaned - They weren't balanced and one was pretty ropey. I found some on that popular trading site but when tested I only managed to salvage 2 out of the 4 but I finally had a balanced set and a spare.
Coils and wiring - one of the HT leads had been making contact with the engine and had some heat damage so i replaced it. Also, stripped down and cleaned the low tension side connectors as they were looking a little tarnished.
Throttle Valve butterfies - Adjusted (sync'd) but only using the 'drill bit method'. I'll revisit this when i get some gauges. They were slightly out ..
Cylinder compression test - As advised I tested this, which came out ok.
Pulse pickup sensors out of alignment. Cleaned and resistance tested both cold and under heat.
The plug with the 'R' has a 5k ohm resistor which acts as a noise suppressor for sensitive ECU's and that interference we used to hear when listening to AM radio when a bike went passed. Thats great but the downside is that it lowers the voltage and therefore you get a weaker spark at the plug. I therefore changed my plugs out to the non-resister type B8ES.
With the BR8ES plugs fitted I saw cylinders 1 & 3 running warm and 2 & 4 cold. I draw therefore that the plugs in 1 & 3 are good. So I swapped plugs 1 & 4 and low and behold 4 started running hot and 1 cold ..which sort of proves the point. I won't have any time this week now so have ordered a set of B8ES plugs ready for next weekend.
**** UPDATE 26th July 2015 ****
She now starts and purrs . I just need it to dry up a bit outside so I can take her for a spin to confirm she runs ok under load.
I managed to clear out a few issues along the way but having just gone right back to basics I appear to have found two faulty spark plugs - WTF! Replacing them with a brand new set has done the final trick. Yes, i did swap plugs around but i think the other issues were masking visibility of a plug issue.
Injectors tested and cleaned - They weren't balanced and one was pretty ropey. I found some on that popular trading site but when tested I only managed to salvage 2 out of the 4 but I finally had a balanced set and a spare.
Coils and wiring - one of the HT leads had been making contact with the engine and had some heat damage so i replaced it. Also, stripped down and cleaned the low tension side connectors as they were looking a little tarnished.
Throttle Valve butterfies - Adjusted (sync'd) but only using the 'drill bit method'. I'll revisit this when i get some gauges. They were slightly out ..
Cylinder compression test - As advised I tested this, which came out ok.
Pulse pickup sensors out of alignment. Cleaned and resistance tested both cold and under heat.